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delilah (delilah)
Junior Member
Username: delilah

Post Number: 3780
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Monday, July 31, 2017 - 09:52 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

My mare backs up at the mounting block, she has always done this now it is worse, I cannot get on her without someone holding her. Once I'm on she is fine. If she walked forward I wouldn't care, but the backing leaves me in an impossible position to get on. I was backing her to the gate and then getting on but now I cannot get her to do that. I have tried asking her to stand and when she backs, send her out on the lunge line, she would happily trot around on the line forever. I'm at a loss.
memom (memom)
Junior Member
Username: memom

Post Number: 4949
Registered: N/A
Posted on Monday, July 31, 2017 - 03:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Time to call Cathie Hatrick Anderson.
"Don't wait for the storm to pass, learn to dance in the rain."(author?)MA
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5911
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Monday, July 31, 2017 - 05:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try to get on, if she backs up, spin her in a couple of circles. Walk her back to the block, try to get on, backs up, spin her. Repeat until she stands still. Pretty much the same with most unwanted behaviors, she's figure it out.
delilah (delilah)
Junior Member
Username: delilah

Post Number: 3781
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Monday, July 31, 2017 - 08:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'll give it a shot!
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5912
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 10:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Stick with it, be patient and make sure not to spin if she stands still. I always say whoa to go along with it so that can associate whoa with stopping, kill two birds with on stone. This is just my way, lots of ways to get it done.
maresrgreat (maresrgreat)
Junior Member
Username: maresrgreat

Post Number: 5397
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 11:15 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bills ways are good ways!! :-) They work!
555 (555)
Junior Member
Username: 555

Post Number: 222
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 11:31 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I use clicker training to fix this.
kiss (kiss)
New member
Username: kiss

Post Number: 139
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 12:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It would seem she's indicating she is not comfortable with you getting on her - for whatever reason.... Perhaps go back to the point where she starts to show that discomfort and take it in tiny steps until she is comfortable then move on from there, step by step. We assume they are pretty cool with a lot of stuff they "ought to be" but they don't think like we do ;)

Does she start to move off when you pick your foot up to the stirrup? Then work on that, until it doesn't bother her. Does she start to move off when you get up on the mounting block? Then start there... you get the idea ;) You could force her into submission, using any number of other methods, but do you really want to do that to your horse?
Abby Peterson (abbyp)
Junior Member
Username: abbyp

Post Number: 216
Registered: 06-2014
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 12:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Also check saddle fit.
pezk (pezk)
Junior Member
Username: pezk

Post Number: 643
Registered: 06-2009
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 12:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Have you had a chiro check her back and / or saddle fit? Horses dont react just because they are behaving badly. They react because of past history. Are you digging your toe into her when you put your foot in the stirrup? All things to think about. If every thing checks out than clicker training can work wonders. Just takes patience and step by step. No force. No toughness. Then you end with a horse that you can mount anywhere in any situation.
kiss (kiss)
New member
Username: kiss

Post Number: 140
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 12:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It could be saddle fit, too...but I'd expect there to be other symptoms of poor saddle fit, while riding, too - not just during mounting... But saddle fit should always be looked at, anytime the horse is showing signs of not being cool with life while strapped to one ;)
kiss (kiss)
New member
Username: kiss

Post Number: 141
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 12:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(pezk) : "They react because of past history." ...that hasn't been corrected in present time ;)
missmagetta (missmagetta)
Junior Member
Username: missmagetta

Post Number: 3582
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 04:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"Correcting" in present time typically translates to punishing. Punishing a horse who is in pain is a recipe for disaster at best and just plain bad horsemanship at worst. Check saddle fit for sure. Clicker training is a fantastic tool for this and Alexandra Kurland has lots of information on it.
"I Don't Whisper, I Translate!"
Happy in NH
kiss (kiss)
New member
Username: kiss

Post Number: 142
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 04:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

missmagetta, If you're reading my comment above and assuming that by "corrected" I meant "punished", then I might suggest that is one heck of an assumption. "Correcting" problems does not inherently mean "punishment". Did you even read my suggestions to the OP, above? I'm not sure where the "punishment" comes into that.... Forgive me if I didn't say the problem hasn't been "shaped" in present time ;)
jcluvhrses (jcluvhrses)
Junior Member
Username: jcluvhrses

Post Number: 12684
Registered: N/A
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 08:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So this is a long standing problem that only recently got worse? What happens if you don't use a mounting block or if you mount from the opposite side?
My inclination is to say that she has been allowed to get away with backing up and now she's simply taken it to the next level. Bill's suggestion of spinning her until she stops and stands is a good one which you can do from the ground or mounted.
Everything is a choice.
delilah (delilah)
Junior Member
Username: delilah

Post Number: 3782
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Tuesday, August 01, 2017 - 08:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

She is an OTtSTB, she has always backed up, she does not back up until the foot is in the stirrup. The trainer mounts from the ground and she usually stands. Saddle has been checked and does fit her. I don't want to force or use punishment. If I feel like I'm getting angry I quit, in her defense she has gotten accustomed to the trainer. I am starting to work with a dressage instructor and I will be the one to ride her, hopefully this can be resolved. JC in my younger days I would mount from the ground but yeah that train left the station. Love all the suggestions!! Thank you and keep em coming!!
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5913
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Wednesday, August 02, 2017 - 07:09 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The nice thing about spinning, it's easy to keep your composure, no need to get angry, just practice like a specific lesson. Take the time required to accomplish one thing, teaching the horse to stand. When you get on and she moves do the same thing. When I say spin, I mean not just the forehand but with a hind end disengagement as well. Say whoa or whatever and tell her she's a good girl as soon as she stops. They usually catch on pretty fast. Horses would rather stand than go in circles. It's easy to control a horse when one hind foot is crossed over the other. A horse that's about to do something like, bolt, buck or rear with jam it's hind feet together. Teaching a hind end disengagement can be a separate lesson. A shuffle over, one hoof next to the other isn't a disengagement. I show this in the video.
Consistency is everything. This is Willy, 4 year old Arabian that hasn't been ridden. I'm getting him ready for his first ride. I spent several days doing ground work before getting on him. All this work pays off even after you start riding. When the S hits the fan (especially on trails) you have some tools built in. I say whoa often when he's moving or if I anticipate him moving.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnVEa9vnmOM&list=PLCLgDSUbXZD9BxACJIqvtQLSwS1Vx26it&index=5
Everything in the video is getting the horse to trust and get in tune with me. To introduce strange and fearful things and trust. A blanket, saddle, bridle, noise, getting on, off, on side , off side etc. Trust is the goal, from mounting blocks to wild animals. This will pay off, basics are very important.
jcluvhrses (jcluvhrses)
Junior Member
Username: jcluvhrses

Post Number: 12687
Registered: N/A
Posted on Wednesday, August 02, 2017 - 07:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you change it up? Different kind of mounting block in different spots? Try breaking it down into steps, foot in stirrup, if she stands nicely give her a treat and get off. Do this many times. Then lay across her back...if she stands nicely treat, if not...spin, as soon as she does it nicely get off. Get a leg over... stands nicely...treat..get off. If not...spin. Mount and sit for a minute...stands nicely...treat...if not...spin when you get success get off and walk her a bit. Sometimes breaking your goal down into many steps and getting success at each step helps you be successful.
Everything is a choice.
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5914
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Wednesday, August 02, 2017 - 09:48 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHjvdmnaddc&list=PLCLgDSUbXZD9BxACJIqvtQLSwS1Vx26it&index=17
Three weeks later. No hurry, no real incidents. If there was, I'd have my tools ready to deal with it. It all basically started from scratch..trust. Arabs are smart willing horses, I've had several. Once they connect with you they're fun to work with.
Same with a mounting block. If I brought him up to the mounting block and something bad happened while I was getting on (who knows) he could associate the incident with the mounting block even though they were not connected, he might think they were.They also know when you're upset, they will read you and anxiety builds. Time to maybe start over and end on anything positive, no matter how slight. Positive reinforcement can also be incorporated into pressure and release training. Yelling at a horse is fear. Temple Grandin top hat incident and fear.
missmagetta (missmagetta)
Junior Member
Username: missmagetta

Post Number: 3583
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Wednesday, August 02, 2017 - 12:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kiss I'm really not overly concerned with how you meant it or what else you wrote nor was I addressing you. I said that is how it is often interpreted.
"I Don't Whisper, I Translate!"
Happy in NH
delilah (delilah)
Junior Member
Username: delilah

Post Number: 3783
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2017 - 11:04 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well it was a soreness issue, her saddle is not fitting well, had a very nice dressage instructor over and she spotted it immediately. So having some chiro and saddle fitting done!! Poor baby!
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5915
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2017 - 12:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well delilah at least you found something. Hopefully that will solve the problem. How about an update after the saddle and chiro adjustments.
delilah (delilah)
Junior Member
Username: delilah

Post Number: 3784
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2017 - 05:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Absolutely, you guys were all really helpful!! I picked up some sorenomore and will give her a good massage in the am, hopefully that will loosen her up some. The young woman I had come out was very knowledgeable and I really liked her. So while waiting for my mare to get everything resolved, I am going to ride with her using my gelding.
jcluvhrses (jcluvhrses)
Junior Member
Username: jcluvhrses

Post Number: 12698
Registered: N/A
Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2017 - 08:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

She's been trying to tell you! Pain issue...always the first thing to rule out. Glad you have figured it out and hope she's feeling better soon.
Everything is a choice.
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5919
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 09:00 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I can't help but wonder if it's a learned behavior, especially from your first sentence.
"My mare backs up at the mounting block, she has always done this now it is worse, I cannot get on her without someone holding her. Once I'm on she is fine. If she walked forward I wouldn't care, but the backing leaves me in an impossible position to get on. I was backing her to the gate and then getting on but now I cannot get her to do that. I have tried asking her to stand and when she backs, send her out on the lunge line, she would happily trot around on the line forever. I'm at a loss."
Yes, horses can learn a behavior from pain.
You also said, when she backs up you lunged her. The problem with lunging her is.. it's too late for lunging, same with round penning. Lunging works for some things but not for this, too much time lag.
Spinning can be done instantly, little lag time.
I've had horses that have done this, I've had horses that have bucked just as I was swingiing my leg over. They learned this and knew their way out of work, they took advantage of their crafty skills and that's also how they ended up at auction.
Disciplining a horse for bad behavior should be done instantly.
For your sake and your horse.I hope it's just a saddle adjustment.
jcluvhrses (jcluvhrses)
Junior Member
Username: jcluvhrses

Post Number: 12700
Registered: N/A
Posted on Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 05:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yes, pain could have been the precursor and then it can become a "learned" behavior. Fix the pain issue then deal with the behavior.
Everything is a choice.
masthill (masthill)
Junior Member
Username: masthill

Post Number: 299
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 07:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you have ruled out pain and Ill fitting saddle, mount in stall. Throw your body over the saddle and see how he reacts, then continue. TBs off the track get tossed up on the saddle. Takes a while to get used to normal mounting. Never saw one in 35 years who didn't adventually come around, UNLESS there are pain issues.
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5922
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 08:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I went for a ride today with my camera, of course. This is how I stop a horse from moving. Pretty simple actually even with a TB, I've had a few. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KeaOKO_bvY
bill gokey (bronco_billy)
Junior Member
Username: bronco_billy

Post Number: 5923
Registered: 07-2008
Posted on Sunday, August 06, 2017 - 09:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Same ride, small problem, easy fix. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cE5q0pulBrw

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